INDEPENDENT SCOTLAND

[child of the mist]

Springer, When did the Swiss army last use their knives to repulse an invading army.
Should England be invaded by another country at least it would be up to us to get involved or not and "ON WHICH SIDE" FREEDOM

[child of the mist]

Storlaks, I didn't see any drug addicts voting at my polling station and very few unemployed, most likely too lazy. Prehaps in an independant Scotland the unemployed would not receive so much in benefits as make it an option to be on the dole, therfore actively seek work. As for the unemplyable, well should we just deport them to England as undesireables, This is not type of independant Scotland I want and look forward to

[plotter]

Being English, but living in Wales, in my opinion not being a political person or even remotely understanding it, if you guys want independance i hope you get whatever you want.. As long as i can still come up and fish in your beautiful country...

[charlieh]

childofthemist said:

As for the unemplyable, well should we just deport them to England as undesireables,

I think this is already happening. Certainly a very significant proportion of the drunks who hang around in my local park are Scottish.

[ibm59]

Aren't you the lucky one then. ;D ;D

[acw]

charlieh said:

childofthemist said:

As for the unemplyable, well should we just deport them to England as undesireables,

I think this is already happening. Certainly a very significant proportion of the drunks who hang around in my local park are Scottish.

;D
Surely not in multi cultural south london .Highbury drunks are multi ethnic ;D

[hornet]

Just a thought.

Norway shares the North Sea in terms of refining oil and gas. They have or had a tourist industry with salmon fishing and i guess they have the same set up on the fishing industry.

I would also imagine that they would have similar industry to ours albeit that our Electronic / Engineering industry has disappeared to low cost European / Asian countries. So how does Norway manage to cope and run ok.

A revamp of the ship building, manufacturing, coal industry, fishing industry, textile industry would definetly make Scotland one of the strongest nations on the planet instead of becoming a nation full of spongers and divide. We are one of the top countries in the world on Medical Technology yet we have one of the poorest NHS in the world. Why?

The Tories and Labour have had more than enough time to change our country but what have they done. So Independence and the SNP need a chance as all before has failed.

OMP

Hornet

[Fruin]

Hornet,

I have heard that Norway built up a large cash reserve from their oil and gas. That will be used for investment for transport, health, education etc, for many decades to come. Why did Scotland not do this? The money all went south to fund the South East.

The reason that we see little or no money from the many technological break-throughs that are made in Scotland, is that in order to attract the funding to continue or develop the work, the projects have to move south (or abroad). I believe that, if we controlled our own destiny, the funding would come to us, rather than us going to the funding.

[ibm59]

fruin said:

Hornet,

I have heard that Norway built up a large cash reserve from their oil and gas. That will be used for investment for transport, health, education etc, for many decades to come. Why did Scotland not do this? The money all went south to fund the South East.

The reason that we see little or no money from the many technological break-throughs that are made in Scotland, is that in order to attract the funding to continue or develop the work, the projects have to move south (or abroad). I believe that, if we controlled our own destiny, the funding would come to us, rather than us going to the funding.

The Shetlands are a prime example of correct usage of oil revenue.
A percentage of all oil/ gas revenue from Sullom Voe oil terminal is clawed back by the local council and used to subsidise local social infrastructure.
As a result of this the islands have one of the highest council spending rates per person and one of the best standards of living in the Union. Mind you , it's dark for half the year so there is a downside.
What a pity the oil's running out just as we may have a crack at home rule.

[ibrox]

If we where lied to in the 70s about the oil and gas running out who's to say were not being lied to now ?

have they stopped looking for other sites to produce oil and gas in the north sea ?

I know nothing about the oil and gas industry this is why i ask

[ibm59]

When oil majors start prospecting in inhospitable waters ,ie. west of the Shetlands, deep water- bloody awful weather , I think perhaps the writing's on the wall for the "calmer" North sea.
Think you know about bad weather? Believe me you don't until you've spent 10 days rolling your guts out waiting to get into Sullom, sunny little place in local speak , Voe. Hell on earth.

[rennie]

Dear All North of the Border,Hope you get what you want and it goes well for you,if collectively you need any advice on home rule just ask any Yorkshire Man(or Woman we are not sexist here) we have had self imposed home rule for century's,the trick is just ignore westminster(no capitals by intention)or indeed any words of wisdom? from south of Sheffield.Lets face it people cant help being born outside of the peoples republic we don't hold it against them(much) its not there fault really and the more southerly they are,well its an affliction that cant be helped just leave them to their own little world.
If things take a wrong turn and go against you don't worry they will never get to you,they will have to get past us first and that will never happen.From one superior race to another,let them win from time to time or they will rush off crying to nanny and mummy and daddy will have wasted all that brass on that posh educational establishment.Any road up its question time on the box now,must see how the geographically challenged are doing these days. Yours with that smug superior satisfaction(to which you are welcome to partake of) Pedro.

[macd]

charlieh said:

childofthemist said:

As for the unemplyable, well should we just deport them to England as undesireables,

I think this is already happening. Certainly a very significant proportion of the drunks who hang around in my local park are Scottish.

I hope you are making light of this topic charlie.

If you are having a pop lets have the figures from your survey work. You obviously spend a lot of time hanging around parks.

[clydebuilt]

ibm59 said:

When oil majors start prospecting in inhospitable waters ,ie. west of the Shetlands, deep water- bloody awful weather , I think perhaps the writing's on the wall for the "calmer" North sea.
Think you know about bad weather? Believe me you don't until you've spent 10 days rolling your guts out waiting to get into Sullom, sunny little place in local speak , Voe. Hell on earth.

Were you running from theWest of Shetland Schiehallion and Foinavon FPSO's ibm59.
I worked on an ROV construction vessel out there for years and apart from maybe the Bay of Biscay on a bad day or the Southern Ocean, your right the weather is particularly gruesome at times. Still sorts the men out from the boyos ;D

You mentioned the North Sea's decline, to be honest they are still managing to eek out every last drop and new technology is helping.
Only recently the company I work for installed new pipelines and subsea structures to begin more withdrawal on very old fileds where originally they couldnt touch the deeper oil/gas.

Presently, deep water prospecting and construction is only limited by technology and the weather factors (including logistics)

The deepest we work to is around -3000msw at the moment but when the technology becomes available then it would not seem too pie in the sky for 4-5000 -msw soon. (Mid Atlantic etc)

Every country is racing ahead to go deeper and find the big reserves and I think Scotland will do the same.

How its governed well that a different matter. We could take a leaf out the Norwegian's book regarding the dispersal and accounting of the profits.

[albyn73]

akflyrod, Alaska is not a seperate nation, it is one of America's states, sold to the USA for $10,million dollars from the USSR [RUSSIA]. The reason it prospers is the fishing and tourism. iainjay, I too was all for SNP in its infancy, and being a member for a year[it was the only way we could get in to their dances, costing five bob] and i suppose we were all taken in by the thought of independence for Scotland, its only when you get older that you see the light and as you said yourself, its not Alex Salmond, I honestly dont see him as the Saviour for Scotland and all the problems we have had with the Auld Enemy. At least 25% of oil was going to the USA, as they said it was to pay for all the drilling and exploration equipment hired out to all the main companies involved in the North Sea. The Sedco drilling rig i was on was hired to "BP". Remember Norway built most of its own gear, and everything from North Sea oil went back into Norway, not any other country, unlike Scotland where everything went South. Take shipbuilding, look at Tyneside, the Clyde all decimated and nearly void except for BAE, companies in Europe bidding for ships have the backing from their governments, in the UK [except for naval ships] the company is on its own, thats why the Queen Mary2 was built in france, thats why the far eastern nations came over here to see how it was done, in every industry and went home and did it better. All the famous people who invented the many different things we are living with today, And what have we got to show for it, made in--china,taiwan,korea,vietnam,india. Whatever happened to Scotland......?

[charlieh]

macd said:

I hope you are making light of this topic charlie.

If you are having a pop lets have the figures from your survey work. You obviously spend a lot of time hanging around parks.

Yes, intended as a flippant comment, Ross, but it's not without a basis of truth.

I have two dogs which I walk twice a day in the park which is more or less at the end of my road, so I suppose I'm there quite a bit though not necessarily hanging around . Because my work is based at home, I may go over there at different times of the day, depending on whether I need to see clients etc, but I'm there pretty consistently, five days a week.

I haven't conducted a serious and in-depth sociological survey, but there are a couple of Scots guys who I see on a fairly regular basis (though come to think of it I haven't done so for a few weeks). One is more reserved than the other, but they're generally quite aimable except when really steaming, and we usually exchange a few words. There are at least another three guys, some or all of whom join them occasionally, who I think are also all Scots, though when they're all together they're generally partying hard and it's not always easy to tell what language they are speaking.

I haven't identified any other social or ethnic group who use this particular little bit of park as regularly or in such numbers. Make as much or as little of that as you like.

[ibrox]

What's drunken Scotsmen in a park got to do with Scottish Independence. I'm sure there's as many drunken English on this side of the border so geez a break eh! Don't stereotype us all, mate.

[macd]

' I was walking the dog m'lud.' ;D

we also get a significant proportion of pissed englishmen in our fishing huts. particularly this season as they have f-all else to do. ;D

[child of the mist]

charlieh said:

childofthemist said:

As for the unemplyable, well should we just deport them to England as undesireables,

I think this is already happening. Certainly a very significant proportion of the drunks who hang around in my local park are Scottish.

[child of the mist]

"very significant proportion-- Scottish" I'm sure the two of them would love to know they are a very significant number. Maybe its because you think one of us are worth many of you !