mikeyny,it all depends on where your pal fishes and how good a caster he is.The Rio has a 100ft head and will be better suited to big rivers and unless your pal is right on his casting game a longer rod too,essentially the Grande Spey is for big rivers and casters who can lift and cast a long head to cover the water.The Airflo is about 70 ish feet(others will advise here)head length and probably better suited to a 14ft rod and easier to manage for a less experienced caster and better on small/mid sized rivers. They are both very good lines in their field,best way to look at it is if your pal is a very good caster regularly casting a long length of double taper line then the Rio Grande Spey would be ok(but maybe try a longer rod) for the other75% of fishing options then the Airflo would be the better bet.In all honesty if the casting instructor says the Grande Spey is the line the rod must be a real beast as a Grande Spey will be a lot heavier than the Airflo in equivalent sizes.Oh and I believe the Airflo is cheaper that might count.I use the Rio Accelerator which has an 80ft head and some of my pals struggle to get the best from this line as they think its too long/heavy for them.When that line expires a Grande Spey is on the list to replace it.Don't be put off by the Airflo its a cracking line and will do the business and is probably the safe bet. Pedro.
Thanks for those quick replies rennie and springer just to fill in some of the details , he fishes on the river Laune and is at the foot of the mountain as regards casting ability but learning fast , his main problem was that with the Rio windcutter when he had finished his cast he had to retrive line by hand , mabey to get the belly back to the rod to cast out again . AIRFLOW the total length is 140 feet and its 9/10 F 680 Gr. Head Length 50 1/2' to 57'
RIO GRAND total length is 130 feet and is also 9/10 F 900 Gr. Head length 90 '
the Airflow is $58 and the Rio is $75 .
He can try the Airflow and if it is not suited to his style of casting then i can get him the Rio the following week as my wife will be flying to Ireland to join me and can bring him one .
Main thing is to get the correct line for the job .
mikeyny,if your pal is at the bottom of the learning curve then the Grande Spey wont do him any favours at all in fact I would say its a no no.Far better off with say a Mid Spey,Mastery or 70ft Lee Wulff,all sort of similar in the performance stakes. Cat amongst the pigeons time now,what about the Monteith line gets nothing but praise from those who try it and its a multi-tip for versatility,can also be fine tuned length head wise so your pal can get the best from it there are threads about this line on this site.Only thing is its a bit more in the cash stakes but you do get what you pay for.(its also made by Airflo).The man himself posts on this site so you can contact him direct for the relevant tactical info you might want and order one to boot too.Plenty of high average ability casters struggle with Grande Speys I would strongly suggest no. Pedro.
mikeyny,if your pal is at the bottom of the learning curve then the Grande Spey wont do him any favours at all in fact I would say its a no no.
Plenty of high average ability casters struggle with Grande Speys I would strongly suggest no. Pedro.
This is another post to say what ever you do don't buy the Grand Spey for anyone far less a beginner. The issue is not even the 95' head, it is more simple than that. The massive fundamental flaw in that the AFTM rating is simply wrong for any standard 15' and 16' rod....and as for a 14'...So, hence, in Springer's line pool it is the 8/9 that is being offered for 10/11 rods and that is spot on, but only even if you have the experience to handle the long head length.
I bought the 10/11 for 16' 10/11 rods four years ago. I had it out once and took it straight back to the world's most productive salmon pool. Rio should have a health warning on this line such as line rating is only right for 18' clothes poles of the same line weight....bad Rio
I think the whole AFTM system for spey lines is utter crap anyway.
I wanted a cheap multi-tip line for my Ian Gordon #11/12 and found it difficult to get such an AFTM rated line readily. Saw a Mid-Spey on ebay but it was a 10/11, so almost by-passed it. Being a bit curious I looked at the Rio website and found the head weights. Those who know the Ian Gordon rods know that the ideal head weight is also stated on the blank. The 10/11 Mid-Spey was 2.5 grams heavier than the ideal head weight but I thought this would probably be better for me. Bought it, tried it and have never looked back - what a combination.
Did the same with my Ian Gordon #7/8 and bought an 8/9/10 Rio Windcutter multi-tip - again what a combination.
So this goes to show that head weight rather than AFTM rating is a much more accurate guide to matching lines with particular rods.
If you look at the head weight of the Grand-Spey it is 71.2 grams, a whole 17 grams heavier than the ideal weight. God knows what that would be like to cast. Would agree with CLaG...baaaaaaaad Rio
Back to the thread. My first spey line a few years ago was a 75' head which I struggled with. Got an Airflo Delta Spey 55' head which was much more manageable. Once competent with the 55' moved onto the Rio Mid-Spey at 65'. Only now am I looking to go up to a 75' head. I would say I am only half way up the mountain face at the moment but the Grand-Spey or any other long head is still up amongst the clouds. I am sure many on this forum will agree - walk before you run.
I have to agree that the Grand spey is too much line but the next question is , if he has to retrieve line at the end of each cast to cast out again with the windcutter what is the line most suitable for him ? I have E-mailed him the link to this discussion and hope that he can ask his own questions . I have enough flies to tie , leaders to make and worries about my Sage 2 piece and airport security/TSA wheather to put it in with the luggage or carry it on board .
First off, if you're looking at Airflo, consider the Delta Long at 65' - 67'. A more fishable alternative than the 55' Delta/Windcutter if you don't want to strip line.
Don't discard 75' with long rear tapers as a potential purchase for they cast more like a short rear taper 65' footer (a.k.a Delta Long). My I. G. Partridge 75' line is recommended to be cast with the colour change at the top hand, leaving a little over 60' clear of the tip on a 15' rod. I've often cast a Delta Long with a couple of feet of overhang, meaning that when comparing the length of line outside of the guides, I actually have more out with the shorter Delta Long, than with the I.G. line. Important if you want to minimize stripping line, but irrelevant otherwise. I've never successfully cast a long rear tapered line while attempting to use some overhang, but short rear tapers usually are not a problem.
About the GrandSpeys, the old ones were real beasts and we had to downsize them two line sizes if we wanted to use the entire line on a rod. Simon G. admitted once on his forum that Rio rated these old GS lines only for the first 60' where they more or less matched the AFTMA rating. They never thought that people would actually try to lift and cast the whole thing. The old GS line was like a 65' chunk of DT hooked up to the fat belly of an overweight Windcutter.
The new GS lines match the new Denver Spey line standards and are much nicer casting lines -- ones that actually match the rod rating. I have the new GS 7/8 for my CND 7/8 Solstice and it works very well -- a very fishable line. Again, the colour change is at the hand, not the tiptop so for my 75' - 7/8 that means a little over 60' out of the guides -- quite manageable. BTW for comparison purposes, the CND 7/8 Solstice casts a DT-10-F very nicely. In some of it's literature, CND calls this rod a 7/8/9.
He has decided that he wants the Grand Spey so thats what i am getting now for him , i still have the Airflow and it was a Delta Long that i got so he can put it on his rod and give it a go and if its not suitable then i can return it . there's not much more i can do but i will give a report on the findings when i am over there .
Now all i have to do is get a PVC tube for my rod and pray that it gets there in one piece .
Leaving for Ireland on Thursday so thanks to everyone for the advice and wish me luck .