Czech Nymphing

[say]

CLaG and Co have posted several messages regarding the method of Czech nymphing for Salmon.

Would I assume this is done in the same manner as fishing for trout, where you cast upstream using a floating line, long leader and weighted fly and it's the lifting action on the downstream swing which brings the fly to life..?

I've not done this method before, as you can see from the post but if this method does produce the odd fuishie then might be worth a try when the colliedog has failed.

Any info would be appreciated

SAY

[Fruin]

Say,

IMO it is nothing new in salmon fishing. I know some anglers that have been fishing similar methods for years, usually in low water conditions through pots and channels.

I used to fish a drifting method for sea trout when I was a nipper. The technique was any weighted nymph about maggot or grub size (usually in a cream or white colour), cast upstream and dead drifted back down stream. The minute the line stopped or stuttered I would strike. Deadly for sea trout, but I know people who used to employ it for summer salmon and grilse. Not seen anybody doing it for a while on my local rivers... mmm... must try it again!!!

With the czech nymphing I presume it would be with a shorter line over known lies, and also that the sudden lifting of the nymph would induce the take.

There was an article in one of the angling magazines a few years ago about fishing artificial stone fly nymphs over salmon that have been sighted. Although, I think the technique involved watching for the salmon mouthing the fly and then lifting into it. Shrimp anyone?

[ceilidh]

Interesting, Fruin,
Like 'Say' I was also interested to know if there was a specific nymphing technique for salmon. I would assume that this would apply mainly on small spate rivers, however, I can think of some 'washpools or back eddies in larger rivers where this might also possibly be effective.

[sagecaster]

IME it only really works when the water has warmed up and in lowish flows. It can be fished in any pool where you can target fish, the trick is getting the weight of the nymph right relative to the flow of the stream and the depth of the pool.

Large weighted mayfly style nymphs seem to work best... 8-10's although, I have caught them on a tube this way, so size does not appear to be a major issue as long as the water will "carry" the fly.You have to use a quite a short line otherwise the current will pull the fly away from you and you lose control. Think of it as subsurface dryfly, its a similar technique, cast upstream, let the nymph sink and dead drift and as it nears the fish get the nymph to rise from below and over the fish over its head...sink and draw.. and surprise him.

In heavily populated pools you have to be careful of foul hooking, its never happened to me however I've heard that this can be a problem.

Another method you should try is the dry "Bomber", I waxed on about this before here, its not that productive in Scotland, but it does work, hell it's exciting!

Over to you ClaG.

[Sloggi]

I've tried this method over the last couple of seasons when the water was dead low and the weather hot. This was mainly on the North Esk. Had one fish on and eventually off but nothing else. I used a GRHE goldhead. The thread is interesting - thanks.

Sagecaster mentions the "Bomber". I've never tried this fly but have used Knowles' "Yellow Dolly" with occasional success. Perhaps if, as we've seen in recent years, the summers are hot and dry we may find these two methods will be developed further.

[exerod]

I've tried nymphing a few times over the years and always got some responce from the fish. The odd thing is that although the induced take method has moved fish the only two I've ever hooked have taken it dead drift when it was about to hit them on the nose. One of these had already followed the nymph to the surface twice, from 8 feet down, before taking it dead drift inches above the riverbed.
Because of the nature of the pools I fish (deep pots on small spate rivers or deep holes under banks on chalkstreams) I've used big heavy nymphs to get depth quickly, maybe if I could get smaller offerings down there they would take better?

[colliedog]

Interesting thread and something I have been experimenting with over the last couple of seasons. A few of the conclusions I have come to are as follows -

it's a method for attacking known lies (preferably known to be occupied) at short range - hence the preference for low water conditions although it does work in higher, colder water (I have connected with a few whilst "bugging" for grayling in Oct-Dec). I have not had any success using it to "search the water" although on smaller rivers this would probably work (see previous reference to fish caught whilst graying fishing).

Fly pattern doesn't seem too critical, but weight is. The technique seems to work by getting the fly down to fish level and then raising it to induce a take. It can take a deceptive amount of weigh to get down in 5' of fast water - I tend to use small flies tied with one or two tungsten cones. Sometimes I use 3/8" brass bottles or little copper micro tubes and have had to use two of these on occassions. Dressings tend to be sparse with a bit of movement (spider like). Small shrimpy things in red, orange and brown also work.

The simplest method is the chuck, drift and lift used by czech nymphers but with a bit of practice a dead drift followed by a lift can be acheived by casting upstream and maintaining contact (high sticking) or square, mending upstream and then "dump mending" as the fly drifts downstream. These terms will be familiar to anyone who has nymph fished for trout with guides in the US or Canada - these guys are masters at dead drift techniques (with and without indicators) that you only rarely see used over here (well on rivers at least - the 'tache or bung is infamous on certain stillwaters).

As mentioned, there is nothing new in salmon fishing - both Falkus and Grant refer to "nymph" fishing. Grant also describes a sink and draw method downstream in slow water.

With current conditions as they are I would expect to start hearing of a few catches of difficult fish on these methods over the next few weeks!

Regards

CD

[minitube]

New Zealand Nymphing with a strike indicator would better describe the method I have used. The strike indicators made from ethafoam on a cotton bud tube, Davy McPhail makes them, they are called sighters in Ayr. I use a long tapered leader with the sighter between two sliding rubber stoppers. very big nymphs 6's and 8's, one caddis pupae which is the best pattern - heavily weighted under and made from woven flexi floss strands usually 3 amber under and 4 brown on the back, less strands on smaller flies. Fiery brown dubbing thorax, copper rib over all that, short light red game hackle, pheasant tail thorax cover, optional gold bead. Also one heavily weighted Hares ear with gold bead. Two nymphs close together, about 12 to 18 inches apart. I do use a dropper rather than tying one nymph to the bend of the other but call it New Zealand style as I will fish at medium or long range also unlike Czech Nymph.

Only works in settled clear water. Most salmon and grilse takes are pull your arm off takes where everything rips away. I am searching rather than inducing takes, most takes are on dead drift as the nymphs sink. I do not use the strike indicator as a float, it is always set over depth slightly, the nymphs hinge against it as they sink. I have timed the sink rate and cast only far enough upstream that as they are about to touch they are just below and I lift them up by tensioning them and flip them up river again if in close or cast up and out if fishing further out. fan all the likely areas a little at a time starting close and at the bottom of the stretch moving out each successive cast then moving up the effective fishing band width and starting close again. Almost all takes are on the dead drift. The faster the water the better but it still works on many glidey areas of the Moy. Considering the amount of large trout that take the pupae, trout anglers should not be worried about fishing large nymphs.

Have talked to a test angler who uses a heavily weighted nymph with a short black marabou tail lead underbody, peacock herl body over, silver cone head. He is sight fishing and the dilver conehead helps, he also uses an induced take.

[castlikeaghille]

colliedog said:

Interesting thread and something I have been experimenting with over the last couple of seasons. A few of the conclusions I have come to are as follows -

it's a method for attacking known lies (preferably known to be occupied) at short range - hence the preference for low water conditions although it does work in higher, colder water (I have connected with a few whilst "bugging" for grayling in Oct-Dec). I have not had any success using it to "search the water" although on smaller rivers this would probably work (see previous reference to fish caught whilst graying fishing).

Fly pattern doesn't seem too critical, but weight is. The technique seems to work by getting the fly down to fish level and then raising it to induce a take. It can take a deceptive amount of weigh to get down in 5' of fast water - I tend to use small flies tied with one or two tungsten cones. Sometimes I use 3/8" brass bottles or little copper micro tubes and have had to use two of these on occassions. Dressings tend to be sparse with a bit of movement (spider like). Small shrimpy things in red, orange and brown also work.

The simplest method is the chuck, drift and lift used by czech nymphers but with a bit of practice a dead drift followed by a lift can be acheived by casting upstream and maintaining contact (high sticking) or square, mending upstream and then "dump mending" as the fly drifts downstream. These terms will be familiar to anyone who has nymph fished for trout with guides in the US or Canada - these guys are masters at dead drift techniques (with and without indicators) that you only rarely see used over here (well on rivers at least - the 'tache or bung is infamous on certain stillwaters).

As mentioned, there is nothing new in salmon fishing - both Falkus and Grant refer to "nymph" fishing. Grant also describes a sink and draw method downstream in slow water.

With current conditions as they are I would expect to start hearing of a few catches of difficult fish on these methods over the next few weeks!

Regards

CD

Continuing with Collie's excellent starter for ten, I thought I'd throw in a bit more detail about the terminal end. As Collie says, weight is critical - so how do you achieve it? Fixed weight flies are of limited value so here's a trick or twa. Unfortunately, the scanner operator wasn't in best form, but hopefully it's clear enough to make out.



Ok, counting by numbers:

1) Mini cone heads tied up on liner tube. We use these as tail flees. Extra weight can be gained by adding lined tubes

2) Mini tubes for tail flies tied on aluminum for durability. Fished on a two feet trace from the leader ring, these flutter enticingly in the current. However, no reason not to use any fly you want and add lined cones to the trace if you need weight. This year we are going to try fishing a 1 1/2" light tube here to try and recreate the presentation of a floating devon - or guie wormie

3) These are hen hacked bottled tubes that flutter like a parachute when fished sink and draw - not caught a salmon on one, but the big Broons and Sea Troots find them very tasty

4) Mini red and black Francis (or is it Frances?) - tail flees well, if yer gonna fish a shrimp imitation then might as well fish it like a
shrimp

5) Basic unlined fox fur tubes. This what you make the dropper and main source of weight with the fluro beads and unlined weight in six. You make up a fly with cones and beads. Burr the cone end and slip it all inside the front end of a rabbit tube. See 8. The trick is to make this tube the minimum weight you think you will need. If in some parts of the pool you need more weight to get down, because it is deeper or faster, then simply cut the dropper off at the leader ring, slip on a pre-lined cone (there will be tears if you don't pre-line them) and vice versa when you need less weight.

6) Beads and weights. Note lined cones above the beads.

7) Leader rings - they also come in 3mm and 1.5mm. We fish a manufactured tapered riverge leader of 14' to a 16lbs point. The dropper 5" and tail trace 1.5 - 2' is made of Seagur.

8) This is one we've dressed up for our next visit to the MWC Prize of day's fuishin for salmo on Upper Tweed in autumn on offer for the wittiest name

Regardez

CLaG

[exerod]

Upper Tweed you say...

Conehead Walkerburn Angel



Ps. Interesting that most of your flies are conventional winged flies rather than nymphs for what is mainly an upstream tactic.

Andy

[severnfisher]

weenie nymph?


What success I've had with this tactic has been with red teeny nymphs. A simple and effective shrimpy pattern.