Tips to Gillie's

[scotty]

"get yourself a drink on me" only for the ghillie to discover, once you have left, that his pocket contains a tea bag !!


;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

fantastic

scotty.

[salmoseeker]

sinkingtip said:

HOW TO TIP - THE MECHANICS

I assume that 90% of forum members already do this - it is the anglers who are new to this sport (and I see it every season) who perhaps need the advice and / guidance from more 'seasoned' fishers who have a duty to uphold traditional values and preserve the sporting etiquette of this wonderful thing we call "fishing". I now wait with baited breath for the 'flack' .

[salmoseeker]

you're not serious are you sinking tip - you're a wind up merchant

[sinkingtip]

Hi Salmo - whats not to be serious about? Might come as a bit of a shock but if I am going to take the time to write posts of this length then you can betcha I am serious !!

[kercock]

You are the clear winner sinktip,you lost a few at the "start"but finished streets ahead,well done.

[sinkingtip]

kercock said:

You are the clear winner sinktip,you lost a few at the "start"but finished streets ahead,well done.

Thanks Kercock - just a pity that it had to seem like there was some kind of 'contest' going on with the earlier posts. I am kind of old fashioned in some respects - someone hits you...you have to hit back (in a literary sense of course ). I would just like to put that one to bed now given a choice. Quite happy to put it all down to 'misinterpretation' by all parties concerned - a 'fault' of this kind of medium I guess - infact, got myself into a bit of bother in a previous post / thread over my use of the bold function.....a forum member thought I was shouting at him when, in actual fact, I was simply using the bold function to create an 'emphasis' and to display a certain aesthetic in my use of typography . BTW give my regards to your new 'oppo' Gary - a really nice guy, a good fisher and (potentially) a great ghillie. Under your guidance I am sure he will flourish - watch yer flea box though !! . Respect.

[sinkingtip]

HOW MUCH - AND FOR WHAT LEVEL OF SERVICE ??

The question with no answer.....well almost. A lot has been written on these forums regarding how much to tip and what, realistically, anglers expectations of their ghillie should be in return for a 'bung'. The following is my interpretation of what constitutes a 'bung-able' situation together with ball park figures.
Firstly - the definition of a "good day" should be "good company" and that the ghillie has done all he can to ensure that your chances of 'connecting' have been maximised eg. (in no set order of importance)..... organising the party, ensuring fairness based on the anglers individual capabilities and knowledge, explaining the pools / lies as appropriate for the conditions and time of year, giving advice on tackle and tactics, ensuring your personal safety (although with some fishers this can be a full time job in its self !!), ensuring that you depart the beat at the end of the day with more knowledge than when you first arrived.... and generally trying to ensure that the party have had a bloody good day / week and an enjoyable experience. In short - the ghillie's responsibility is to show you the water and by directing you to certain 'spot/s' at least ensures that you are not wasting your time by flogging water devoid of 'running' or 'resting' lies - the rest is firmly up to you.

If this has been the case then I think a tip is in order.

Remember, at the 'off' a ghillie cant be with the whole party all of the time - some members of the party may have to find their own way to a pool temporarily un-aided (usually decent pools maps are provided) whilst the ghillie ensures that novices or rods unfamiliar with the beat are taken care of as his first priority - and who could argue with that ? Once he has attended to such matters he, no doubt, will make a bee-line for you next !!.....unless, that is, if Brigadier Cholmodely-Warner's missus (who is not one of the party) doesn't demand spey casting lessons before or after lunch (always a tricky one ). Remember - he cant be a everywhere all of the time - certainly don't expect him to be deep wading at your shoulder, and only your shoulder, all day to the exclusion of others. . If you do require the services of your own 'dedicated' ghillie then this can usually be arranged for a reasonable daily rate with a bit of advance warning and ONLY through the beat ghillie - NEVER turn up with your own ghillie without having first discussed this with the beat ghillie in advance (guaranteed to cause bad feeling )

Maybe a few words would not go amiss here on what you should NOT expect your ghillie to do .......fetch and carry your kit from / to your motor (if he can he will offer) : build up your rods (have seen situations where a 'party' rolls up with a jeep full of assorted rods/reels and tells the ghillie to assemble 3 fly and 3 spinning rigs whilst they 'mill' around the hut poncing it up - if he can he will - otherwise crack on yourself and give the guy a break) : tie your knots - unless you physically cannot tie a decent blood or turle knot always tie your own knots : supply any kit whatsoever unless this has been discussed prior to your arrival (most good ghillies tend not to begrudge giving fishers some 'specialist' small items of kit with no expectation of monetary gain - just to be helpful and ensure that you are equipped !!

What a tip should never be equated to is fish . I have heard all too often over the years 'geezers' saying at the end of the day that "they would have tipped the ghillie if they'd caught fish" - sometimes to the ghillies face !! - if you ever hear fellow guests coming out with 'kack' such as this then treat them with the contempt they deserve. Fair enough - if you don't tip then you don't tip - at least have the decency to be consistent if nothing else and continue not tipping even on days when you DO get fish (much less hypocritical and infinitely more palatable I think). CATCHING fish is up to you dear 'neebs' (I am not a Fifer but I love the word)......how 'hard' you fish, how much attention you have paid to the ghillies briefing and your ability and willingness to fish confidently and 'read' the water - and, of course, to "hing on to them" .

Assuming the above is, more or less, what you are presented with then the equivalent of £10 per day/rod would be the minimum. £20 would be extremely decent of you and much appreciated...... anything over and above that is really up to what price you would put on the opportunity to 'feed' off the ghillie's vast knowledge and experience honed and gained over many years on that particular piece of water. I have seen guys hand over £100 each having caught nothing but having had a fantastic day and learnt something (OK- that was back in the Thatcherite yuppie era ;D) and I have also seen 'geezers' hand over 'zip' having had the ghillie run after them like the proverbial 'blue ersed flea' all day. Give what you want to and what you can afford - if nothing else then give the reward of laughter and having been good company (just waiting for the flak now ;D !!)

[donnieW]

That's between me and the ghillie - nobody elses' business.

[sinkingtip]

donniewhiteford said:

That's between me and the ghillie - nobody elses' business.

I agree totally Donnie. The only exception to this as I have stated, and in my opinion, is when you are in a party that is taking the fishing for a week and are giving the ghillie a 'party bung'. Anything else you might give over and above this is totally between you and him.

[sinkingtip]

"Alcohol And The Fishing Day - Ghillie and Guests".
Anyone got a cat ?? I have the pigeons !!

Before we go any further (and I don't intend to make this post as long as the other two in the 'trilogy') let me state quite categorically that I am not anti-bevvy....ask any ghillie who has ever sampled my home made sloe gin ;D.
Alcohol and days spent on salmon beats tend to go hand in hand - fact. However, IF the ghillie does not want to partake of strong alcohol at 9am then don't force him or make him feel in any way anti social should he politely refuse. For the fisher it is a once a week or once a year event. To the ghillie it is a six day a week issue. What earthly good is a ghillie, or guests come to that matter, to man nor beast if he / they are incapable of speech by lunchtime . Excessive amounts of alcohol are dangerous at the best of times - 10 times more so on a river !!
I assume anglers designate one of their party to drive ?. If this is not the case then I can only assume they are fully aware of how 'difficult' the pursuance of their sport would be if licenses were to be lost (we all know someone !!)....especially the ghillie who might even run the risk of losing his job. A dram to kick start the day - one over lunch and one at the end of the day to toast the 'fush' is civilised - anything more is excessive. Fair enough, if the ghillie lives a couple of fields away and the guests have a missus who will drop everything at a moments notice and pick them up (not!!) then by all means get rat arsed.....at the close of play ;D.
At this point I have to differentiate between drinking and bringing alcohol to the beat. By all means present the ghillie with a bottle of decent malt as part, or not, of his tip at the end of the day. Most ghillies I know have a fairly large range of unopened malts at home which come in extremely handy and financially beneficial at Christmas time (ghillies need to give gifts too !!). Spare a thought for the guys liver and his ability to function as a family man. If there is any doubt then just leave the 'strong' at home and come to the beat equipped with a couple of tins of Vimto (anagram of vomit) or perhaps some Creamola Foam if it is a special occasion .
Lastly, it horrifies me every year to see anglers taking a bottle (or bottles) of whisky into the boat (before / after lunch) during the early part of the season when harling might be part of the 'menu'. Apart from the obvious dangers, it is a known fact that alcohol reduces the body temperature. This coupled with inactivity (you are sitting in a boat remember) and air temperatures often just above freezing are basically a health hazard at best and a recipe for disaster at worst .
The sermon endeth

[williegunn]

sinkingtip said:

Next post : "Alcohol - ghillie and guests".

I have yet to remember meeting a gillie who drinks strong drink.

[elwyman]

williegunn said:

sinkingtip said:

Next post : "Alcohol - ghillie and guests".

I have yet to remember meeting a gillie who drinks strong drink.

Strong drink does affect one's memory. ;D

[sinkingtip]

Thanks Spey - heartening to know that my posts are appreciated, as most forum members posts are.

[Fruin]

Sinkingtip,

I've commented on your posts in a negative way before, so it's only fair that I say well done on this thread. I agree with everything that you say on this issue.

[Sloggi]

Doesn't matter how many reams of parchment you churn out Sinkingtip, none of it has altered my views on the subject which are duly noted above

[kercock]

There is always one ! Sinktip,it may be an idea to start another thread about ghillies and drink etc

[Fruin]

Sloggi,

Surely if you can afford a day or week on a beat with a ghillie, you can afford to tip him if he has given sound advice and helped you get to know the water.

I would rather not have to tip somebody at the end of a days fishing, as I struggle to get the cash together for the fishing alone, but, if a ghillie is there and he is a good ghillie, he will get a tip - not excessive, but a sign of my appreciation for there dedication to angling and anglers.

As has been said before, if nobody tipped the ghillies, I'm sure there would not be many of them doing the job. If the riparian owners have to pay them more, the rents would go up accordingly.

[altmor]

Fruin,

You have pm.

[Sloggi]

Kercock,

A brief read over the other 100+ posts and one would have to agree that mine is not a lone voice.

Fruin,

My decision not to tip a ghillie has nothing to do with an ability to do so or not. I would refer you to my earlier posts outlining my reasons.

However, it's been an interesting thread and the only reason I felt the need to post again was the inference (not from Sinkingtip) that this was about "winning" the arguement. I don't see our Forum as a place to "win" or "lose" but rather as a place to debate issues and share experiences.

In conclusion, if I may be so bold, I would suggest that our thread would have been very different 50 years ago and for that, we can all celebrate growth and development. Hopefully in another 50 years, many of us here will recall this thread with the enthusiasm it rightly deserves.

[hornet]

Sinktip,

I'm glad you have joined as it is a better read now that you are in full flow. ;D

Everybody to their own i say.

Cheers,

Joe