Tips to Gillie's

[tayboy]

as a minimuim wage spechilist ive started tipping the gillie much too the distgust off my wife hoo tells me too get back too the trout

[munrokiller]

Stoater,

Your opinions are noted however I'll stick with my own, we are entitled to them after all - I'm certainly not asking you to agree with them. Differing opinions lead to interesting debate and this thread has certainly had that. Finally, without beginning to quote any names, I think a few folk on here agree with a few of my points also, however if they don't I'll still sleep tonight !

Tight Lines but don't expect too many tips from the Ghillie, apart from the obvious described at the beginning of this thread.

[sinkingtip]

It may be just me but I have found that over the 30 odd years I have been game fishing that most ghillies are happy just to have knowledgeable guests who are willing to learn the beat and take on board advice. Ideally guests should be pleasant, respectful, courteous and be aware that the feudal system has, thankfully, long gone and that 'Ted and Ralph' situations are becoming less common. Should certain guests expect that the ghillie doffs his cap and touches his forelock every 5 minutes then we (the rest of the party) should make our displeasure known and treat them with the contempt they deserve . I think qualities and 'rewards' such as enlightening conversation and transfer of knowledge are much more important to ghillies rather than grudgingly being given what basically amounts to the equivalent of the price of a packet of f*gs and bottle of dark beer.

[williegunn]

sinkingtip said:

[. I think qualities and 'rewards' such as enlightening conversation and transfer of knowledge are much more important to ghillies rather than grudgingly being given what basically amounts to the equivalent of the price of a packet of f*gs and bottle of dark beer.

Some people have strange ideas, every gillie I have met would rather take the money than listen to some opinionated prattler.

[salmondan]

I have never fished with a ghillie so I am perhaps being foolish in trying to add my two penneth but from my perspective a small tip at the end of the day for the man is not at all unreasonable. I would suggest £20 or a bottle of malt. This would obviously depend on the service given throughout the day. The man who helps you out with his intimate knowledge of the river, known lies and so forth, perhaps would wade with you (depending on how many other rods he has to care for), net fish and even help out with any casting faults deserves a good tip. The man who says hello in the morning and goodbye in the evening, unseen for the rest of the day, deserves nothing but his wage.

I feel that it is the knowledge of the water gained over a lifetime that is worth the few extra pounds on top of the ticket price. It could, after all mean the difference between a good day and a blank, the latter I have all too much experience of.

[williegunn]

opinionated prattler, sorry I have corrected my spelling error to ensure clarity.

[salmoseeker]

Not like you Willie.

To be honest I'd be happy exploring and fishing the river alone - I probably don't want or need a ghillie; rather work it out for myself, thanks. (Even - being controversial - tying my own flies on)!

However, that's just me and I have to recognise that most of the ghillies I've come across here on the Tay are outstanding men who do a great job......so why do they need to be tipped?

John

[sinkingtip]

Hi Willie - thought that one would get you going - ye git me ? Being an "opinionated prattler" isn't so bad is it ? Better that than being a mono syllabic half wit that wants the world to see a foto of his motor ;D !! I think you do most ghillies a great disservice by implying that they have no time for informed and"opinionated" dialogue with their guests. Didn't really want to go down this route but you started it - thought this was supposed to be "friendly" site. BTW the minimum I would give a ghillie is £20 - and quite often it evens itself out at about £40. The crack about the "dark beer" and the packet of f*gs was to see if any there were any idiots out there such as yourself who would come back with some kind of banal reply - well done you excelled yourself !!

[williegunn]

sinkingtip said:

Hi Willie - thought that one would get you going - ye git me ? Being an "opinionated prattler" isn't so bad is it ? Better that than being a mono syllabic half wit that wants the world to see a foto of his motor ;D !! I think you do most ghillies a great disservice by implying that they have no time for informed and"opinionated" dialogue with their guests. Didn't really want to go down this route but you started it - thought this was supposed to be "friendly" site. BTW the minimum I would give a ghillie is £20 - and quite often it evens itself out at about £40. The crack about the "dark beer" and the packet of f*gs was to see if any there were any idiots out there such as yourself who would come back with some kind of banal reply - well done you excelled yourself !!

sinkingtip said:

It may be just me but I have found that over the 30 odd years I have been game fishing that most ghillies are happy just to have knowledgeable guests who are willing to learn the beat and take on board advice. Ideally guests should be pleasant, respectful, courteous and be aware that the feudal system has, thankfully, long gone and that 'Ted and Ralph' situations are becoming less common. Should certain guests expect that the ghillie doffs his cap and touches his forelock every 5 minutes then we (the rest of the party) should make our displeasure known and treat them with the contempt they deserve . I think qualities and 'rewards' such as enlightening conversation and transfer of knowledge are much more important to ghillies rather than grudgingly being given what basically amounts to the equivalent of the price of a packet of f*gs and bottle of dark beer.

So where does the truth lie?

Do you tip £20-40 pounds or do you entertain the gillie with your wit and repartee?

I have never met you so I have to react to what you post, if you tell me you believe gillies would, let me quote " just to have knowledgeable guests who are willing to learn the beat and take on board advice." than accept a tip I point out you are wrong.

[Sloggi]

WG,

Probably time to leave Planet Sinkingtip and return to Earth

[sinkingtip]

Both !! - "wit and repartee" and a decent bung !! And please feel free to "react" to my post..... surely that is what this site encourages ?? - just leave out your attempts at humour and the cheap insults in future .
Much appreciated.

[williegunn]

I don't do cheap insults, at £350/day my insults are anything but cheap

[ibrox]

Stick with it sinkingtip you sound ok to me .

[ibrox]

Fair comment Springer, but I do think individuals have the right to their say without being slated. For the sake of the forum and you, last post has been amended. ;D

Mike

[sinkingtip]

Hi Springer - well put and totally agree !! However, it does look pretty plain to me that his 'dig' was specifically aimed at yours truly (sorry to disagree) and, in my opinion, totally unwarranted. I agree that informed banter does not 'put shoes on the bairns feet' - that is why I bung - and bung well !! Having fished with ghillies for nigh on 30 years I have also heard them say on many occasions that they would rather not receive a 'tip' in exchange for not having to put up with the shenanigans of some guests (stupidity, rudeness, lack of respect for the fish, lack of respect for the rest of the party, a total "know it all"......the list can go on but I don't have the time right now). In a nut shell - I believe that both sparkling wit, repartee, transfer of knowledge etc etc (not boring pompous individuals spouting on - we all know what that sounds like) in tandem with the sound of folding paper money being 'tastefully' passed over to the ghillie via a handshake at the end of the day are a fundamental part of my sporting day out - neither being exclusive to the other.
I agree that this is a friendly forum - thats why I enjoy it so much - and I am horrified at the idea that any of my posts should be responsible for bad feeling or negativity generally - that was never my intention !! But, and I am sorry to re emphasise the point, I do think that WG was specifically having a go at me - didn't 'sign up' for that. End of....as far as I am concerned......lets move on. Apologies where apologies are due.
PS. this post has not been ammended (yes it has)
PPS. It is actually a nice motor WG. Sorry to 'dis' your vehicle.

[speyghillie]

Hi Guys,
Having been on the Spey for the last 12yrs i never really cared if i got a tip or not, as long as everyone enjoyed there fishing, most Ghillie have other things on there mind like should i get another job, will i have a job in ten years, i have never known so many guys wanting out of the job, as for £20,000 a year , i never even came close in fact i always worked on a Sunday at a trout fishery to make ends meet, and that is where you will find me now , AAIA has now made my job part time, the guy in the beat above me is leaving the guy bellow me has left .
I guess thats down to all the money we earn, the thing that has killed my job is the levy on the Spey , even the tackle shop has closed.
I was'nt bothered about tips, just wanted to be in a job, and be able to pay the bills , if you want a job that does'nt pay there are plenty of Ghillie's jobs on the river and i think there will be even more next year.
Gordon

[sinkingtip]

Hi Gordon - a sad fact of life you describe there. Unfortunately the picture you paint is similar for a range of professions these days. I guess there are guys out there will read your post and 'think on' in terms of this idyllic lifestyle anglers think that ghillie's have. Dont get me wrong - I know there are a barry load of ghillies have 'solid' contracts and basically a good 'boss' (probably the most impotant element of all) - others unfortunately dont. I have seen most variations on the employer / employee relationship issue over the years and know that things for you guy's have been getting less comfortable in recent years. I wish you well for the future.

[sinkingtip]

HOW TO TIP - THE MECHANICS

Just thought I would push this thread on a little. We have heard a lot of variations on the theme of tipping ghillies. Some do / some don't : some a tenner / some more. On the assumption that you are in that group of fishers who do tip there is an element of this process which I feel has not yet been debated.....HOW to tip a ghillie. Before I give you my opinion (radical thought I know ) on HOW you should tip a ghillie let me give a few examples of how you should NOT tip a ghillie......and believe me I have seen with my own eyes the following examples .

1) Don't count coins out directly onto the fishing hut table and leave it there for all to see.
2) Don't stand there with a £20 note (or whatever denomination you have) and ask if the ghillie has change.
3) Don't stand there trying to amuse the rest of the party with quips like "Aye, you'd better be prepared to get us fish today Wullie or there will be nae tip for you " (particularly embarrassing ). Of course, if the ghillie has genuinely done 'eff all' for you and has shown clear favoritism towards others in the party then fair enough - eff all it is !!
4) Don't proffer the ghillie a banknote in front of other guests forcing him into a situation of having to reach for it. A variation on this one is that once I had the grave misfortune and total embarrassment to see a 'geezer' (sorry, cant use the term 'angler') do this with a £50 note only to pull it back at the last minute (to howls of laughter from the other 'geezers' in the party) as the ghillie stretched out his hand. I will never forget that - it was grotesque !!
5) Decide what YOU feel you want to tip the ghillie and NEVER let him overhear you discussing with the rest of the party how much you should give him.

There's five examples for starters - there are others I am sure.

Now.........HOW to tip a ghillie - there is only one way - discreetly and at an appropriate moment. The following applies to individual anglers as distinct from day / week group parties (a slightly different format is required in a 'group' situation).
Approach the ghillie at an appropriate point eg. when he is not in the middle of leading off the toast !!. Have your note/s folded neatly in the palm of your right hand and open with something like "Thanks for a great day Wullie and get yourself a dram or two on me" or "Really enjoyed your company and hope it is not too long before we / I get a chance to fish with you again" (something like that)..........and then shake his hand transferring the 'vouchers' from your hand to his via a manly and firm handshake. Simple. You shouldn't expect the ghillie to look grateful - just a very subtle raise of one eyebrow ( ) as if to say "nice one" and the retort "thank you very much sir - much appreciated" will suffice.........but do try to do this away from the 'public glare'.
A variation on this (the only one I can think of) is that you 'stick' your hand with the note/s very quickly into his breast or side pocket as YOU thank him - maybe he has his hands full of fly rods or waders !!. Dont, as happened to my brother once, stick something in the ghillies breast pocket with the words "get yourself a drink on me" only for the ghillie to discover, once you have left, that his pocket contains a tea bag !! (I am not kidding).
Weekly or daily parties should really decide the 'party' tip at an appropriate point prior to, or during the week, and perhaps enclose the cash inside an envelope containing a card (always a nice touch ). In this situation it would also be perfectly acceptable for individuals within the party to take the ghillie aside and bung him a few bob more as an 'extra' for, perhaps, spending quality time with you outwith official fishing hours, or helping you to improve your casting technique on a one / one basis (as an example). I assume that 90% of forum members already do this - it is the anglers who are new to this sport (and I see it every season) who perhaps need the advice and / guidance from more 'seasoned' fishers who have a duty to uphold traditional values and preserve the sporting etiquette of this wonderful thing we call "fishing". I now wait with baited breath for the 'flack' .

PS : For information, regarding the £50 episode the ghillie simply looked at the 'geezer' with a wry smile and walked away. As far as I am aware the 'geezer' tried to get the ghillie to eventually accept the tip which was politely declined - and quite rightly so - ghillies are men (sometimes women ) - they are professionals - not performing dogs

[ibrox]

Very well said. I have never needed a ghillie to date, that's not because I'm a tight arse but because I fish association water, mainly at night for sea-trout. If I ever did I would make sure he was tipped on the quiet, making sure to cause no embaressment.
However if I had been the ghillie that had the fifty quid pulled away from him I don't think I would have been able to contain myself, he would have been chucked in to the river. I would have no patience for a-holes like him.

Good job I'm not a ghillie eh! ;D ;D

Mike

[salmondan]

Further to my earlier post, I'm off fishing tomorrow. For the first time I will be on a beat with a ghillie. Like AA, I too normally only fish association waters. I might add that already, after only two phone calls, I know for a fact that I will receive top class service, the amount of work this man has already done to ensure that I get the best day's fishing is enough to earn him a tip. Tackle,fly,tactics,water height,water temperature, the list goes on. That sort of stuff may be expected from some of you guys, but it's new to me. Rest assured sinkingtip, I shall be as diplomatic as I can, thanks for the advice, although the old "pull the note away at the last second" trick might just come in handy one day . ;D.